His grave is in the Stanley Cemetery, so he would have died in the Stanley internment camp. He has this remarkable tombstone, complete with thistle, whereas other gravestones from that time are very plain and simple. I wonder if it was carved during the internment, or put here after the war?
I don't think the resources existed in the internment camp to produce a tombstone as elaborate as this. It must have been erected after the war. John Ross was initially interned in the Kowloon Hotel before being moved to Stanley. Also in the Kowloon Hotel was a Mrs Christine Miriam Ross, who died in Stanley in July 1942. I wonder if they were related?
they were close enough in age - he was 70 and she was 58 when they died. His job was listed as marine engineer in this book: Hong Kong internment, 1942 to 1945: life in the Japanese civilian camp at ... By Geoffrey Charles Emerson
I agree that John's tombstone must have been made post-war. The tomb stones put up in Stanley cemetery during internment were actually marker stones from the area, the inscriptions painstakingly added. I have forgotten the name of the internee who did most of these, but may be able to find it somewhere, I think it is mentioned in one of the books or records I have. (Perhaps John's relatives postwar might have used the original stone as a base and embellished it.)
The Mrs.Ross who died in camp in July 1942 I'm pretty sure was no relation to John Ross. Christine Ross was billeted in the Married Quarters in a room off the same corridor where my family and I lived. I worked in the office of Tweed Bay Hospital: my diary for July 30th 1942 says 'Mrs. Ross of Room 18 was buried.. she was a late middle-aged lady, on her own in camp... She just gave up trying to live. I felt how dreadful it was for her, when listing her poor little collection of personal effects at the hospital.''
Geoff Emerson:
Long ago (some 30 years ago when I started my Stanley research) either an internee told me or I read (Stericker's papers in HKU?) that the gravestones were carved by two white Russian policemen who somehow had the skills (I wonder where they got the tools) and that the stones came from a pile of milestones which just happened to be found in the Camp (in the prison grounds, I would guess). If Barbara thinks John Ross' stone was made post-war, it probably was. I've always thought it might have just been an odd stone found in Camp and used as a gravestone because of its attractiveness. I would think the plain stones were just as found; can't imagine any cutting was done by the internees. But it's possible! Maybe the tools were there, used by prison inmates for 'work'. Until we find some written records, anything is possible.
Brian Edgar:
In Strange Harmony William Sewell says that the headstones were 'made from boundary stones which had been collected round the St Stephen's grounds' (162).
Hong Kong Boy has the carving done by 'two Russian prisoners' (156) but I don't know the Himsworths' source for that.
As Geoff says, we need written records!
Barbara Anslow:
If John Ross's magnificent gravestone had been made and erected during internment, it would have been the talk of the camp! I can't remember seeing it during my visit with you to Stanley Cemetery in Oct. 2008, but I guess we didn't get round to seeing all the graves there.
Somewhere in my memorabilia I think I have seen the name of an internee who was credited with doing most of the inscriptions on the stones, and will try to hunt it down.
Tony Banham:
Dave Deptford tells me:
"In the book 'Silks, Satins, Gold Braid etc etc' by Jim Shepherd, at Page 105 appears - '...I would be failing if I did not pay due respects to another brother officer by the name of Robinson,who was in fact a White Russian who changed his name by deed poll.He took it upon himself to quarry into shape suitable headstones for all those who died in the Camp'. G F Robinson, Sgt E 24 B 20,04 1908,enlisted 27.5.1930,employed with Anti-Piracy Contingent and regraded to Sub Inspector post war,awarded Colonial Police Long Service & Good Conduct Medal 1948,retired shortly thereafter. Regret I don't have his Russian name."
Comments
His grave is in the Stanley
His grave is in the Stanley Cemetery, so he would have died in the Stanley internment camp. He has this remarkable tombstone, complete with thistle, whereas other gravestones from that time are very plain and simple. I wonder if it was carved during the internment, or put here after the war?
John Ross
I don't think the resources existed in the internment camp to produce a tombstone as elaborate as this. It must have been erected after the war. John Ross was initially interned in the Kowloon Hotel before being moved to Stanley. Also in the Kowloon Hotel was a Mrs Christine Miriam Ross, who died in Stanley in July 1942. I wonder if they were related?
john ross
they were close enough in age - he was 70 and she was 58 when they died. His job was listed as marine engineer in this book:
Hong Kong internment, 1942 to 1945: life in the Japanese civilian camp at ... By Geoffrey Charles Emerson
http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=n3BvnhsnOngC&printsec=frontcover#v=onepage&q&f=false
A couple of interesting
A couple of interesting replies on the Stanley Camp discussion list:
Barbara Anslow:
I agree that John's tombstone must have been made post-war. The tomb stones put up in Stanley cemetery during internment were actually marker stones from the area, the inscriptions painstakingly added. I have forgotten the name of the internee who did most of these, but may be able to find it somewhere, I think it is mentioned in one of the books or records I have. (Perhaps John's relatives postwar might have used the original stone as a base and embellished it.)
The Mrs.Ross who died in camp in July 1942 I'm pretty sure was no relation to John Ross. Christine Ross was billeted in the Married Quarters in a room off the same corridor where my family and I lived. I worked in the office of Tweed Bay Hospital: my diary for July 30th 1942 says
'Mrs. Ross of Room 18 was buried.. she was a late middle-aged lady, on her own in camp... She just gave up trying to live. I felt how dreadful it was for her, when listing her poor little collection of personal effects at the hospital.''
Geoff Emerson:
Long ago (some 30 years ago when I started my Stanley research) either an internee told me or I read (Stericker's papers in HKU?) that the gravestones were carved by two white Russian policemen who somehow had the skills (I wonder where they got the tools) and that the stones came from a pile of milestones which just happened to be found in the Camp (in the prison grounds, I would guess). If Barbara thinks John Ross' stone was made post-war, it probably was. I've always thought it might have just been an odd stone found in Camp and used as a gravestone because of its attractiveness. I would think the plain stones were just as found; can't imagine any cutting was done by the internees. But it's possible! Maybe the tools were there, used by prison inmates for 'work'. Until we find some written records, anything is possible.
Brian Edgar:
In Strange Harmony William Sewell says that the headstones were 'made from boundary stones which had been collected round the St Stephen's grounds' (162).
Hong Kong Boy has the carving done by 'two Russian prisoners' (156) but I don't know the Himsworths' source for that.
As Geoff says, we need written records!
Barbara Anslow:
If John Ross's magnificent gravestone had been made and erected during internment, it would have been the talk of the camp!
I can't remember seeing it during my visit with you to Stanley Cemetery in Oct. 2008, but I guess we didn't get round to seeing all the graves there.
Somewhere in my memorabilia I think I have seen the name of an internee who was credited with doing most of the inscriptions on the stones, and will try to hunt it down.
Tony Banham:
Dave Deptford tells me:
"In the book 'Silks, Satins, Gold Braid etc etc' by Jim Shepherd, at Page 105 appears - '...I would be failing if I did not pay due respects to another brother officer by the name of Robinson,who was in fact a White Russian who changed his name by deed poll.He took it upon himself to quarry into shape suitable headstones for all those who died in the Camp'. G F Robinson, Sgt E 24 B 20,04 1908,enlisted 27.5.1930,employed with Anti-Piracy Contingent and regraded to Sub Inspector post war,awarded Colonial Police Long Service & Good Conduct Medal 1948,retired shortly thereafter. Regret I don't have his Russian name."