Sai Kung Fui Yiu Ha

Andrew Suddaby
Mon, 11/26/2018 - 19:14
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Sai Kung Fui Yiu Ha

I don't think that this is of Yuen Long.  The countryside immediately around Yuen Long was very flat. 

N.B.  After so much debate, Phil has found the exact location.  His perseverance and skill identified the slide photograph as having been taken at Sai Kung Fui Yiu Ha, right next to the road running up the Eastern side of the New Territories.  As he points out in the 1950s the road might have been called either Po Tung Road or possibly Hiram's Highway - which I suggest might be the original name, and it would have been just to the left of the photograph.  Hopefully, I can now rename the pin and move it to the correct spot on the Gwulo map.  Please let me know if any more changes are necessary.  I have edited the next paragraph in an attempt to remind readers of how  long and difficult a journey we have all been on.  Andrew  

The following fascinating and rather tortuous debate finally reveals that the village in question is actually the coastal one of Fui Yiu Ha in Sai Kung.  Aerial photographs can sometimes shed a light, even though they might be blurry, on how things were in the past. Thank you to everyone who has entered into the Gwulo spirit of detective work that the site is so good at providing.  As my final comment at the end of the thread suggests, perhaps somebody might be able to visit the correct site and take a photograph for then and now comparison.  One might even be available on Google Street view. I have now added a pin on the Gwulo map in what I hope is the correct place - but it might need adjusting.

 

Date picture taken
1958
Author(s)
Bodel
(Paddy) Geoff (1958-59)
Gallery
Bodel, (Paddy) Geoff (1958-59)
Shows place(s)
Sai Kung Fui Yiu Ha [????- ]

Comments

I'd like to offer an alternative site rather than tear everyone else's down all the time, it's only fair that I should make a suggestion rather than just find fault with everyone else's. Apologies if my posts have upset anyone.

I *think* that when Moddsey's ebay image says "Sai Kung Village", it is meant - specifically - the old village rather than some village within Sai Kung District. Please look at this image taken from Tymon's excellent HK Map Viewer for 1963. It shows the whole of what was once Sai Kung village peninsula. The original photo has offered some clues - close to water (but not exposed to waves), a sloped background with a more modern type of building (as opposed to the shoreline traditional style houses) with a small parcel of land (demarcated by what looks to be a green metal gate), a small track around the water's edge, a clump of something at the far left of the screen, an advert on the side of a house (so it must be for the benefit of someone nearby or passing through?).

Sai Kung Aerial Image 1963
Sai Kung Aerial Image 1963, by Philk

I've squared a section below that includes several of these features with some additional ones.

1. It is in fact part of Sai Kung Village
2. Hut on a hillside behind (with the roof ridge running the correct direction, as well as a small area with parked cars which indicates some open land next door. This hut actually lines up with house number 181, although the current building is a modern 3 floor village house.
3. The small track by the water
4. Two sets of waterfront buildings. Look closely and you can see the one on the *right* has two small huts in front of it similar to Paddy's image - the roof lines of these small huts also seem to match. The row of buildings on the left have some front plots which can just be discerned on the aerial image. Also, the front of the buidling allows a line of sight to the wall on the other one, which was my main problem with Tui Min Hoi.
5. The clump on the left could be the small bit of land that is intersected by the left hand of my rectangle.
6. Note the protected area of water and the fact that the advert wall of the building would be the one facing the main road (Po Tung Road) which would explain why the advert was placed there.

Sai Kung Aerial Image 1963 Edited
Sai Kung Aerial Image 1963 Edited , by Philk

Anyway, please ponder and let me know what you think.

If you need to see the original resolution, it can be viewed on HK Map viewer.with the 1963.2 reference layer.

 

I must say the aerial maps have been put to good use in trying to identify the location of the scene. 

A long way from Yuen Long but I think Phil has got it right with his analysis and the location. Well done and good collaboration by all. 

Phil - you are a star!  I kept looking at the Sai Kung peninsula in the aerial photograph book, wondering whether there was another similar small bay to the one at Tui Min Hoi, and there it was staring me in the face.  Being so close to the important road it would have immediately attracted the photographer's attention.  In those days most photographs, including my own were taken close to roads.  Now, I think that I will have to edit the first page in this roller coaster of an investigation.  Any suggestions?  Regards, Andrew

nice to know that staying up half the night with my eyes glued to my computer screen has paid off. In terms of edit I don't know if that stretch of road has always been called Po Tung Road or whether it was originally part of Hiram's Highway. Also, maps appear to mark this area as "Fui Yiu Ha" (灰窰下) rather than as Sai Kung Village, so I'm not sure which is better. Perhaps just mark the image as "Sai Kung Fui Yiu Ha" until someone can better advise.

Admirable detective work on this fascinating photograph.

Fu Yiu Ha is absolutely correct with the photo being taken from Hiram's Highway (at that time probably ending in Sai Kung Market further down the road.)

The building on the hill behing is most probably the original Rural Committee building, still in the same location.

Fu Yiu Ha and the nearby Tin Hau Temple on the other side of the hill is the Sai Kung end of the ancient road from Tai Wai via Siu Lek Yue, Mui Chi Lam, Mau Ping and the (originally named) Delta Pass on the Maclehose Trail: https://tinyurl.com/29pzvpb9 (Walk No 1 on HK's Boulder Trackways)

The houses, originally on the sea front, have been rebuilt but this area of Old Town is still very pleasant.. The bay was reclaimed to built Star Plaza, some industrial buildings (to become housing) and the Lakeside Garden estate. (There is no "lake"!)

There are still some very pleasant Tui Min Hui (Across the Sea) originally sea front village houses on the other side of Lakeside Gardens.

I will submit some modern photos shortly.

Yes, thank you to everyone who has contributed to the investigation of the old slide and helped to proved a successful answer to where the photograph was taken.  Looking at Google Earth and Street view it is just possible to make out where the photographer stood beside Hiram's Highway - most probably on the low, rocky knoll that is visible next to the shoreline on the aerial photograph.  Rather a restricted view on Street View tends to confirm that the old buildings have been replaced by modern ones as pointed out by Guy, but they look to be on the same footings.

Now, as suggested by terewong, perhaps we can turn our eagle eyes to sorting out where the other colour slide named 'Yuen Long village1' in Paddy's gallery was taken.  To me it certainly looks like the scenery that I remember from that area in the late 1950s and, although I have trawled through all my own photographs and others in the 367 Association gallery, I have not been able to match that skyline with that on any other identified images. Judging by the shadows, the camera was most probably pointed to the North, and the slide has not been flipped. Unfortunately, tree planting and buildings constructed in the years since 1950's have severely restricted Google's Street View along the old main road across the New Territories from the West through Yuen Long, Kam Tin and on to beyond Sek Kong - that road is my favourite for a tentative location.  Perhaps there are other images on Gwulo that might show that skyline.  Regards, Andrew 

Thanks terewong.  I don't think that it is Tui Min Hoi.  If you zoom in on this image you will see that, while the foreground looks promising, there are severl discrepancies with the aerial photograph.  The shape of the hillside across the inlet on the right does not match the one on the aerial photograph (where I understand the original Sai Kung village stood.  Also, the row of objects in the far bay is more like a row of sampans or junks than buildings and beyond them is another inlet, or perhaps a reservoir, that does not fit in with the aerial photograph.  Perhaps the promnent high conical hill might provide us with a good lead.

Kat O is surely correct. Here is some history on the RHKJC floating clinics:

Floating clinics, Chee Hong and Chee Wan, 1973

Chee Hong and Chee Wan, with their names chosen by then Club Steward Dr. Chau Sik Nin, were the two floating clinics donated by the Club in 1958 and 1959, respectively, to the government for the provision of out-patient clinical services to residents of outlying islands and remote villages. Chee Hong, built at a cost of about HK$370,000, served the area of the northern part of Lantau, southern and western seaboards of Po Tai and Sai Kung Peninsula. Both ships were constructed by the Taikoo Dockyard & Engineering Company of Hong Kong Limited.

https://www.hkmemory.hk/MHK/collections/hkjc/All_Items/Images/201201/t2…

Hi terewong.  Perhaps you could locate 'Yuen Long village 1'  I suspect that this photograph was taken somewhere broadly in the Yuen Long, Kamtin area - but probably quite close to the main West / East road.  It reminds me so much of some of my own photographs taken in that area, but doesn't match any of them.  The hill profile might be a good starting point. I have just realised that there is a danger of starting up a new thread on this topic!  Please ignore this one and go to the thread already started, which already has one or two contributions.  Andrew

Tin Sum Tsuen, Yuen Long
Yuen Long village 1., by Bodel, (Paddy) Geoff (1958-59)

 

Hi Guy.  In order to avoid duplication of threads, I am switching my replies and comments to the other thread.  You will see that following a suggestion I have also flipped 'Paddy's' image.  There is also a suggestion that the photograph was taken much further to the West on the Castle Peak Road but looking towards the SW rather than the North. Regards, Andrew

Would the photo below be the full view of the original photo? The village houses and the building on the hill seem to match.

1959 Fui Yiu Ha Village, Sai Kung
1959 NT Village View, by moddsey

yes, good find. Definitely a match. The 2-story old building centre right with the decorative roof centrepiece is still around (it's listed as #43 on Open Street Map).

Thanks Phil and Moddsey.  Yes a great match.  Paddy must have taken his photograph from the foreshore just down from the road  and quite close to the buildings on the left of Moddsey's contribution.